Teach a man to fish...

[muntoo]

Hmmm... Are any of you administrators part of this website?

Lego person, same quote... This is pretty suspicious.

Anyways, are we going to keep this quote forever? Shouldn't it be more related to Mindstorms? (I mostly added these two questions because the rest of my post was pretty much useless )

[physics-matt]

Personally, I'm in two minds about this.

On the one hand, I really like the fact that the "teach a man to fish" philosophy is ingrained into the forum. We had so many threads on nxtasy on the lines of "HELP!!! SOMEONE PLZ DO MY HOMEWORK FOR ME!!!", and the likes of Xander and Brian spent so much time politely explaining that this wasn't the way to go about getting help, I think it's important we make a clear statement moving on.

On the other hand, I can't help feeling that the tagline "teach a man to fish" is a little odd for the forum. Maybe it's because it conjures up images of African farmers with fishing nets, but I think it's also because I don't think it describes the essence of what the forum is about to someone who's new to it. Whilst the "teach a man to fish" philosophy is important, I think there are slightly more important things, like the fact that the forum is open for anyone with an interest in LEGO mindstorms regardless of their level of expertise and what programming language/environment they use. In particular, I wonder how the line comes across to someone who was never on nxtasy?

There is also the question of what the implications are for the forum. For instance, what happens if the community starts to loosen its attitude towards doing people's homework? I know there were people on nxtasy who were much more willing to do these things for people; would they be allowed on Mindboards?

Please don't take the criticism the wrong way - like most people here I am tremendously grateful to the guys for setting this up. I'm just not sure if they got this little detail quite right.

Matt

[mightor]

Matt,

On the other hand, I can't help feeling that the tagline "teach a man to fish" is a little odd for the forum. Maybe it's because it conjures up images of African farmers with fishing nets, but I think it's also because I don't think it describes the essence of what the forum is about to someone who's new to it. Whilst the "teach a man to fish" philosophy is important, I think there are slightly more important things, like the fact that the forum is open for anyone with an interest in LEGO mindstorms regardless of their level of expertise and what programming language/environment they use. In particular, I wonder how the line comes across to someone who was never on nxtasy?

Being a newbie at something does not mean you cannot do a bit of research or at the very least tell us what you've tried to get where you are. We don't expect someone with very little expertise to know exactly what to look for but we do expect them to take any advise and fishing rods we give them and try to learn that way. Learning to do your own research is by far the most useful skill you can have when learning something new.

There is also the question of what the implications are for the forum. For instance, what happens if the community starts to loosen its attitude towards doing people's homework? I know there were people on nxtasy who were much more willing to do these things for people; would they be allowed on Mindboards?

The moderators (Brian, Steve, John and I) have a pretty firm stance on this. We don't want to turn these forums into a homework making service. What people do in PMs is their own business but we certainly won't encourage it on the forums. People can ask for directions, but we don't want cut 'n dried programs to be made in an answer to their questions. They'll never learn that way. The trouble with a lot of people asking for home work help is the "OMG, MY ASSIGNMENT IS DUE TOMORROW AND I HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING YET !!!ONE!!!ELEVEN!!" sob story. I feel very little sympathy towards those people. However, come to us saying "I'm working on a homework assignment for a line following robot and I'm having some trouble getting started." is fine. We'll tell you some of the things to try, some tutorials to go with it, and ask you to come back when you've gone through those and let us know how it went. Developing problem solving skills will help them a lot more than begging for ready-made answers.

Regards,
Xander

[spillerrec]

On the other hand, I can't help feeling that the tagline "teach a man to fish" is a little odd for the forum. Maybe it's because it conjures up images of African farmers with fishing nets, but I think it's also because I don't think it describes the essence of what the forum is about to someone who's new to it.

You could rewrite it to something like "Give a man BI and he will be entertained for a day. Teach a man to build and he will have entertainment for a lifetime." (or two). Perhaps "entertainment" isn't the best word, but you get the point.

[afanofosc]

While I agree with Xander, I would say that there is a wide range of interpretation regarding what the philosophy means. Nobody is going to delete posts or ban users who are giving people fish, as it were. As long as you show how you caught the fish it seems like you are free to give it to someone else.

John Hansen

[hassenplug]

There is also the question of what the implications are for the forum. For instance, what happens if the community starts to loosen its attitude towards doing people's homework? I know there were people on nxtasy who were much more willing to do these things for people; would they be allowed on Mindboards?

If we all move on, and the forum changes it's attitude towards doing people's homework, the tag line can always be changed.

When we started this, we all agreed on that phrase, because of what it means to us. The truth is, we could all save a great deal of time by simply handing out answers, instead of struggling to help others learn.

But (as was pointed out here) we DO need to consider that the phrase may not mean the same to others, as it means to us. Maybe we should change it. Here's my first suggestion:

Give a boy a robot, he'll play for an hour. Teach him to build, and he'll play forever.

And second...

Give a boy a robot, he'll play for an hour. Teach him to build, and he'll turn into one of us...

Steve

[HaWe]

K'ung-fu-tzu speaks:
teach a man to fish is a wise attitude.
But give him long enough to eat until he had a chance to learn it finally.

[mightor]

Give a boy a robot, he'll play for an hour. Teach him to build, and he'll turn into one of us...

I am not sure we should be scaring them off with statements like that, Steve.

- Xander

[HaWe]

mee too...

[physics-matt]

Xander: Don't get me wrong, I agree completely with the "Teach a man to fish" philosophy. The point I was trying to make about newbies is that they might find the tagline a bit odd, not that they shouldn't abide by it.

It's a bit like having "Don't plagiarise" as your school motto.

Matt